I'd like to borrow $70,000

[cosmicporch]

I need to borrow

[Websman]

I need to borrow $70,000 to buy a local building. I am willing to issue promissory notes at a reasonable rate to investors willing to help me finance this.


Dude, can you post a picture of the building and give us the square footage. Do you have a business plan?
Sincerely,
You Vulcan friend. :)

[billyjoe]

cosmic,
Is there a shortage of commercial space available in that area ? How much do you think you could lease it for?

---------billyjoe

[Tatnic]

I need to borrow $70,000 to buy a local building. I am willing to issue promissory notes at a reasonable rate to investors willing to help me finance this.

Good for you! My guess is you'll have to have some collateral though. Also, you'll have to do your homework and see what's allowed for uses and if its up to current codes. I noticed fire escapes on the other building but not yours. Its very difficult these days to rent apartments, and for Section 8 purposes its impossible unless everything is up to code. See if you can get the local Code officer or Fire Marshall to take a little look see for obvious problems.

Judging from the picture, this building may have some serious age issues and you need to be very careful in figuring out what they are before you figure out your offereing price. Do you need new wiring? Heating system? Insulation? Is there asbestos anywhere in the building? Lead paint is usually a given for older buildings and you need to know the obstacles associated with that.

And you should also check into whether or not you can "condo-ise" it later on if the market offers that opportunity.

Just because something sounds cheap doesn't mean it will be...there are always hidden costs with old buildings. But if you do a good job figuring those out and get a much reduced price you may make out just fine. Good luck to you.

[Jim Smith]

Cosmic has none......In this day and age were everyone has become a shylock because there's so much money sloshing around, only the most non-credit worth folks can't get money.....Folks are lighting cigars with it.....So, if you loan this guy money using the building as collateral, you're likely going to be owning it yourself inside 18 months.

[billyjoe]

Cosmic,
Here are some observations on older commercial real estate. Do you see any of this happening in your area?

1. abandoned gas stations converted to chiropractic offices, subway sub stores, or used car lots

2. restaurants failing repeatedly in same location

3. as new malls force older commercial areas to empty, storefronts turn into tattoo parlors, tanning spas , new and used books, records, or clothing stores

4. vacant lots and old gas stations become used car lots

5. some larger empty buildings become antique malls

6. mom and pop custom t-shirt lettering shops become common

Upscale laundromats seem to do well when maintenance and cleaning is done regularly.

----------------billyjoe

[Websman]

Cosmic has none......In this day and age were everyone has become a shylock because there's so much money sloshing around, only the most non-credit worth folks can't get money.....Folks are lighting cigars with it.....So, if you loan this guy money using the building as collateral, you're likely going to be owning it yourself inside 18 months.
Jim, where's your faith in the human race. Negativity is not the answer to the worlds problems.

Lighten up...share the wealth...be happy! :)

[Websman]

Cosmo,
If you have a casino coming in, you should look into the possibility of some kind of novelty business to attract tourists.

Here's a few thoughts...
1. antiques shop
2. bed and breakfast
3. adult video store
4. exotic dance club
5. liquor store

The dance club would have to be approved by your local poiticians, but would do well with casinos around.

[Jim Smith]

they better be prepared for a brutal assessment of the situation....There's no question a bank will review the situation with only one concern, am I going to get the money back, with interest.....and, since a bank will charge less interest than any of us would be willing to accept, there's something wrong here.....because anyone would seek out money with the lowest cost unless of course something is preventing them from doing so.

[Jim Smith]

either in the markets or bulletin boards.....These guys around here don't even take a stock home overnight let alone lend money out long term.....Now if you'd be able to repay the money by 4pm each day, you might get a intraday loan from someone around here....lol...

[Websman]

I once gave a bum in Atlanta a dollar, then I changed my mind so I wrestled him down and got my money back with interest.

[IIC]

Cosmo...you don't need financing set up before you inspect the place...Nobody would offer you financing before they knew all the details anyway.

You need to know how much it will take to make this place rentable. Then you need to know if you are going to offer a TI allowance...probably not on this type of property.

What are the local vacancy rates? What are comaprables renting for? What is your projected NOI? Is it multi-zoned? What was there before and why are they gone? What % return are you seeking? Do you even know how to project the value of a building? There's quite a few things you need to get before you ask for financing.

Best...Doug(IIC)

[IIC]

either in the markets or bulletin boards.....These guys around here don't even take a stock home overnight let alone lend money out long term.....Now if you'd be able to repay the money by 4pm each day, you might get a intraday loan from someone around here....lol...

LOL...that's pretty funny Jim...Doug

[Jim Smith]

Look, casinos don't help the local businesses that much if at all....I live near three river boat casinos and they are point of interest type places.....In other words, folks drive there and they drive home. They don't stick around and support anything except a gas station. And the black folks in that area will not get hired by the casino. They'll get some handouts, maybe, from the local community that collects taxes but it won't add to much. The best idea might be a pawn shop for that location.

[billyjoe]

I politely disagree with you, Mr. Smith. I can make this a success. My city of 70,000 is going to see 1.6 million visitors annually thanks to a new casino under construction, half-way completed. One million more dollars per year in revenue will be added to the city budget, as well as create jobs for a community with a large black population, which in turn could raise property values and incomes. I believe that this is a good place to invest in, and that now is the time. The state I live in will also probably see a rise in the minimum wage thanks to the first democratic legislature and governor combo since 1964, which will also help along this struggling community because many people here live at or below the poverty level and a hotel, restaurant, or casino job would be good for them. To sum up: I believe things are improving in the state with a democratic congress sympathetic to minorities and the poor which should help the working poor in this community, 1.6 million new annual visitors in the near future in this city which should boost the economy, as well as new job creation in and outside of the casino area. My collateral is the audacity to hope for a better future for myself, my family, and my community at large, and the willingness to make it work.

Cosmic,
I live very close to a town that draws several million tourists annually. All manufacturing is about gone. Tourists don't spread their money around other than at the tourist trap , gas stations, hotels and motels in a direct line to or from the destination. Have you seen what happened to the mom/pop stores around Atlantic City ? It's seems as though the money would trickle down and out but it doesn't. The casinos have spent billions to make sure any money spent is spent at their location. I'll bet that if you're honestly looking at the situation, there's a lot of empty store fronts in the location you're considering. What makes your site more desireable than the next empty business?

-------------billyjoe

[Websman]

Look, casinos don't help the local businesses that much if at all....I live near three river boat casinos and they are point of interest type places.....In other words, folks drive there and they drive home. They don't stick around and support anything except a gas station. And the black folks in that area will not get hired by the casino. They'll get some handouts, maybe, from the local community that collects taxes but it won't add to much. The best idea might be a pawn shop for that location.

I disagree Jim. You can make plenty of money near a casino with an exotic dance club...and you don't even need great looking girls. I wonder, though, if Cosmo could talk enough girls into coming to his area....ok, I admit that it's a long shot, but it could work.

[peanuts]

I disagree Jim. You can make plenty of money near a casino with an exotic dance club...and you don't even need great looking girls. I wonder, though, if Cosmo could talk enough girls into coming to his area....ok, I admit that it's a long shot, but it could work.

Q: What is the one thing that makes you feel any better after losing a couple thousand at the casino?

A: A dirty, ugly, sticky, drug-addicted, hunk of gyrating flesh to rub her naked self all over you, take more of your money, and make you feel like a bigger idiot after you leave

Sounds like a great plan, Webs. Are you moving to Pittsburgh? We're getting casinos here. I'm not too happy about that...

[Websman]

Q: What is the one thing that makes you feel any better after losing a couple thousand at the casino?

A: A dirty, ugly, sticky, drug-addicted, hunk of gyrating flesh to rub her naked self all over you, take more of your money, and make you feel like a bigger idiot after you leave

Sounds like a great plan, Webs. Are you moving to Pittsburgh? We're getting casinos here. I'm not too happy about that...


Why, you want to go in partners on a club??? I'm sure we could find some girls. they don't have to look that good.

[Jim Smith]

just not there, that site looks like its on the main street.....

[Websman]

just not there, that site looks like its on the main street.....

Are you sure? I've seen some pretty sleazy looking dance clubs.

[peanuts]

Why, you want to go in partners on a club??? I'm sure we could find some girls. they don't have to look that good.

Give me some figures to look at and I'll consider it. The girls- yeah, they don't have to be the best looking, but they should be "friendly," shall I say?

[DSteckler]

Anyone lending Cosmo money for this = Henry Ford's comment on the Model T: For every seat, there's an Ass.

[Tatnic]

Cosmic has none......In this day and age were everyone has become a shylock because there's so much money sloshing around, only the most non-credit worth folks can't get money.....Folks are lighting cigars with it.....So, if you loan this guy money using the building as collateral, you're likely going to be owning it yourself inside 18 months.

At a minimum he'll need 20% down and a job to show he can cover the mortgage if his occupancies are high. Or if he or his family has some other property to use as collateral (it might have to be as high as 100%) he could probably find a bank to work with. I don't know of anyone who would use the building to be bought as collateral...it has to be another piece of property..no one wants to build a house of cards anymore.

Cosmic, I doubt you're going to have any luck getting any money off the internet but I wish you well. If you can make this work it can be a very good investment but its hard work and dealing with tenants is a whole other challenge that if you're not up for it you'll get screwed.

[Tatnic]

Take a look at your net worth. If 10 of you were to let me borrow 7,000, and I were to somehow totally default so you couldn't get your money back, how is that any different to you than losing some money on a stock? I am a person whose life you can make a difference in. I think it's amazing people would rather risk losing 7,000 on a stock to a nameless, faceless investor than make a lasting change in somebody's life. A bank probably won't let me have a loan because I don't have an income, but like I said, the income will come from the building. You can email me if you want... just click my name and send me email.

cosmo, you sound like a sweet kid, but you have to realize that 70,000 may only be a fraction of the total cost needed to make this work. Before you get any tenants the spaces need to be in tip top shape and ready to roll. That takes time and money and is on top of the purchase price most likely.

Your best bet may be to talk directly to the current owner and see if he'll work with you on this, say you put down 10% and do a ballon payment in 5 years. If you make it work in that period of time, ie get a steady income going, you should have no problem getting a bank to carry you for another 15 to 20 years. That's your best bet IMO. Good luck to you.

[IIC]

I had to make a quick post earlier because I had to hit the road for about 6 hours....However, I commend Cosmo for coming up with something creative...I always say..."The way to come up with good ideas is to come up with a lot of ideas"

But there are more than a few problems here...Why is the building so cheap? Probably because it should be demolished. I did some checking in Waterloo, IA...Why is this building so much more expensive psf?

http://index.loopnet.com/xNet/MainSite/Listing/Profile/ProfileSE.aspx?LID=14876807&linkcode=10850&sourcecode=1lww2t006a00001


Yes...it is in Davenport...But is there a difference? For $70 grand it looks like you may have to come up with a few hundred more grand.

Cosmo...Forget it...But keep your thinking cap on.

If you are interested in Commercial RE I suggest taking a RE Finance course to learn the basics. I'm in RE...But on the Asset/Facilities Mgmt side...I dug out my old course books from the early 80's when I got home...I wanted to post something useful on marketing/valuation/cash flow etc...But it would take me too long.

You mention the casinos are coming...Maybe you should look at some "parasite" biz that could feed off of that...I know the word parasite has a negative connotation to most...But who cares???...Best, Doug(IIC)

[Jim Smith]

on the main approach to 3 of 4 riverboats in my area, there's pawn shops.....There are strip clubs around and on the way to two others....But strip clubs are not on the main street.....if you get something high end like a "doll house" maybe you won't have to keep it so much under the radar in the area. You watch, EZPW will be putting a pawnshop there soon. Strip clubs in iowa, man I don't know how that will fly in a "red state". Strip clubs work well near airports or Florida, both have an abundance of transient folks.

[jblaze71]

Jim,

Strip clubs in Iowa work well. I went to school in Des Moines and trust me the number of rednecks that will drop their whole weeks pay I one night is huge. I think either would be viable but cosmic will need a lot more money than $70,000 for that. Unfortunately waterloo already has a strip club and getting it passed through the city council would probably be a tough road.

[jblaze71]

Cosmic,

I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but you keep complaining that there is no job for you or you are not qualified to work at that job. Three solutions: 1. Go to college at get a degree so that you are qualified for that job 2. Take that job that is available that you just don't want to work 3. Sit at your house an sulk about how bad your life is.

And if you think that because I am a doctor everything came easy to me it didn't. I had many doubters. I one week in college I was told to forget about ever getting into medical school and to quit playing football because I was terrible at both things I tried to accomplish. I could have felt sorry for myself and quit at that moment but I decided to prove everyone wrong and have been doing it my whole life.

I am really not trying to get on your case, but many people on this message board have reached out to you to offer some help and granted you have come up with some ideas but most of them are too grandiose for you at your stage in your life. You need to take baby steps instead of trying to hit a homerun every time.

Just some friendly advice

[billyjoe]

I don't know what I'm going to do. I literally don't know.

Cosmic,
You have computer knowledge. Sell stuff on e-bay. If you don't have anything to sell, buy something that seems to be a bargain at a garage sale or auction and resell it. Learn from your mistakes . Eventually you'll be more and more successful . You can do it.

------------billyjoe

[Jim Smith]

every time I read your posts, one thing comes to mind: you're on the wrong board......This is a trading forum and you have no money. This is already on my last nerve.

[IIC]

I looked for some jobs today. I looked at a bunch of ads for jobs but can't find anything I'm either qualified for or anything that I can do. It has me kind of upset and I'm really pretty despondent about the whole job search thing.


Take a minimum wage job if you have to. I worked at a couple of them when I was young...Gets you some work experience. Plus, at one job I got which was not min. wage but was low paying...After 3 months they liked me and made me a Shift Supervisor...That gave me about a 70% raise...plus it gave me some supervisory experience.

I didn't get what I would consider a real, career type job till I was 25.

Also, it always seems that it is easier to find a job when you already have one. I know when I interview people for a job and they are currently unemployed...I always wonder in the back of my head...Why are they unemployed? They can tell me about layoffs etc...but I still wonder why.

Get out there and pound the pavement...Most job openings don't appear in the paper anyway. Walk right in with your resume and ask to apply...Try that at 50 places and I bet you'll have a job within 2 weeks...The worst that can happen is they tell you no.

I just had another idea...I want you to go down to your local Manpower office on Monday and sign up for work.

I already looked up the address for you...It is at 1004 Decathlon Drive, Waterloo, IA 50701...Their telephone number is 319/233-8473.

On Tuesday, unless you are already working for Manpower...I want you to go down to your local Labor Ready office and register for work...It is located at:

Labor Ready
1818 Williston Ave
WATERLOO, IA 50702
Phone: 319-274-7080

Both of these companies contract for temporary work. Many of the jobs available may not be that great...But you get some experience, some money in your pocket and the possiblity that a company they assign you to ends up offering you regular employment.

I'll expect you to let us know how it goes...Best, Doug(IIC)




http://www.us.manpower.com/uscom/img/spacer.gifhttp://www.us.manpower.com/uscom/img/spacer.gif

[billyjoe]

Doug,
Not to discourage Cosmic, but once I had a Manpower job shovelling out a boxcar of moulding sand at a foundry. It was cold and windy with sand blowing in my contact lenses and I had a bad back. I lasted 2.75 hours and was the third worker to quit that day.

-------A good Manpower job was delivering donated food to the local Salvation Army. They supplied the station wagon and it made me feel as though I was doing some good. Cosmic , I'll bet you could help at a charitable organization for the holidays. They paid more than minimum wages.

-------------billyjoe

[IIC]

Doug,
Not to discourage Cosmic, but once I had a Manpower job shovelling out a boxcar of moulding sand at a foundry. It was cold and windy with sand blowing in my contact lenses and I had a bad back. I lasted 2.75 hours and was the third worker to quit that day.

-------A good Manpower job was delivering donated food to the local Salvation Army. They supplied the station wagon and it made me feel as though I was doing some good. Cosmic , I'll bet you could help at a charitable organization for the holidays. They paid more than minimum wages.

-------------billyjoe


Probably most of their jobs are manual labor...I never said he'd find a dream job there.

One summer I got a temporary job taking inventory at a place that sold wholesale electrical parts...boring boring boring...There were about 10 of us doing it...At the end of our assignment they offered me a f/t job...I didn't take it because I was going back to school.

Cosmo...You should also go to some temp agencies...But don't register at any that charge you a fee...The employer should pay the fees....Also, there is a Goodwill near me...I know they have a job center...Check to see if you have one nearby...Doug

[Tatnic]

Cosmic,
You have computer knowledge. Sell stuff on e-bay. If you don't have anything to sell, buy something that seems to be a bargain at a garage sale or auction and resell it. Learn from your mistakes . Eventually you'll be more and more successful . You can do it.

------------billyjoe

thats good advice billyjoe, it has worked for many people....

...and cosmo, while you're at it, read the Red Paper Clip (google that)...its about a guy who through a long series of trades, starts off with a red paper clip, trades up to a pen and eventually has a house.

[Tatnic]

Probably most of their jobs are manual labor...I never said he'd find a dream job there.

One summer I got a temporary job taking inventory at a place that sold wholesale electrical parts...boring boring boring...There were about 10 of us doing it...At the end of our assignment they offered me a f/t job...I didn't take it because I was going back to school.

Cosmo...You should also go to some temp agencies...But don't register at any that charge you a fee...The employer should pay the fees....Also, there is a Goodwill near me...I know they have a job center...Check to see if you have one nearby...Doug

cosmic...more good advice. But at some point you have to get off your butt and get moving. If you want to hear a little change jingle in your pocket, you gotta shake a leg (good grief that's corny, but he's from iowa, corn, iowa, get it).

[Jim Smith]

He's already at the bottom of a bottle of MD 20/20 sitting on his porch thinking cosmic thoughts.

[IIC]

He's already at the bottom of a bottle of MD 20/20 sitting on his porch thinking cosmic thoughts.

Hey Jim...I'm thinking about quitting my job and daytrading options f/t...Can I borrow a million dollars???...I figure to make 5% a day...I'll pay you 25% of what I make for the rest of my life...Look forward to receiving your check...thx...Doug